[ahydra]

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Matchpoints, both vul. First time partnership so no agreements on forcing passes etc, or even what 3S is really. Ignoring the fact I misdefended like a noob for -1 when it should be -2, 5S is easy, or at the very least we want to double 5C. Who should do more?

ahydra

[Cyberyeti]

You want to double 5♣, no particular reason to expect 5♠ to make (4-1 hearts or both honours with the overcaller and they have bid to the 5 level so may have some outside shape)

I would have bid 4♥ rather than 4♠ if it showed this sort of shape, allows partner to judge (and possibly find the diamond lead if hearts are 4-1, spades 3-1 and 5♣ was in fact making without a diamond ruff)

[helene_t]

It's difficult without a definition of 3♠. Probably W should double but this is easier to see with open cards.

[Tramticket]

You don't want to be bidding 5 over 5 - its usually not a good idea and there are not the total trumps for this action to satisfy the Law.

Even if you had agreements on forcing passes, it surely would not apply on this hand, where the opponents have the balance of points. West might double, I can't see that East can.

Not a lot of blame - unless there is some in the play?

[wank]

west underbid. singleton in opps' suit and all working cards = limit raise.

[rmnka447]

If 5 happens to make on these two hands with 18 total HCP, it's because of the exact distribution and fit of the hands. Do as little as flip East's minor holdings and 5 ♠ has virtually no chance. Good bidding is about getting to reasonable spots not about getting to the perfect result on every hand.

I like helene-t's idea of bidding 4 ♥ rather than 4 ♠ over 4 ♣. It must be forcing to at least 4 ♠ unless West has better ♥ than ♠ (like if West's ♥ and ♦ were flipped). But it also helps West understand what's going on in the hand. I'm not sure I'd think about it at the table if East though.

If anyone doubles, it should be West. West has 1 1/2 QT which includes a sure ♣ trick opposite East's opening bid.

In any case, if West leads a normal low ♠ and East wins, then the 4 ♥ bid really pays off. A ♦ switch can be read easily by West as a shortness lead and you'll get ♣ A, ♠ A, a ♦ ruff and probably a ♥.

I'm not sure I agree West's hand is a limit raise. To me, it's more of a mixed raise, 4 trumps with 8-9 value which makes it sort of a "tweener".

[Dinarius]

You say it's MPs.

If they've stolen your cold 4 Spades for minus 100 or 200, then you're getting average minus at best.

I think that West has bid his eight-loser hand with his 3♠ bid, and he doesn't have another bid over 5♣.

I think he has to double to protect the 4♠ missed. Even two off might not be enough at this vulnerability.

But, the matchpoints difference between 5♣ doubled and making (highly unlikely, thought the correct lead may be hard to find.) and simply 5♣ making is tiny. If it's making, you're getting a terrible score, doubled or not.

So, double and hope you find the right lead for at least minus two. Not easy, I'd say. (Given the Club control, I'm leading a Diamond or a Heart and not a Spade, which may be ruffed. It's almost certain that, if there are Spade winners, they can wait to be cashed.)

D.