[jexa_]

Hi there, trying to switch to 2/1 and that is one of my problems

Opening of 1♠ and lets consider we have something like xx♠,AQxxx♥,QJxx♦,Qx♣, So five card heart suit with 10-11 points.

The auction goes 1♠-1NT-2♣/♦ and then what? 2♥ could be as weak as 5-6 points, 3♥ need a 6suit and with 2NT we will not find probable fit in hearts. So ?

[The_Badger]

hi jexa_

I'm no 2/1 expert myself, but 2/1 does have a lot of advantages of other systems, however there are certain card shapes and fits that it doesn't handle well - and that applies to any system - however these are in the minority.

The ubiquitous 1NT response is partly to blame. The hand you have given I really cannot comment on further as in my view, like yourself, it is one where a 5-3 ♥ fit could be missed, preferring a rather nondescript 2NT contract as its possible final resting place if both hands are minimum.

[Stephen Tu]

Bid 2nt over 2♣. If opener accepts 3nt is supposed to bid 3♥ along the way with 3H and a hand that prefers to play 4♥ instead of 3nt vs. a hand like yours.

You will miss 3♥ for +140/170 sometimes that standard gets to and play 2nt instead which might score worse. Just have to live with it and hope to win it back on other hands.

[mike777]

many play BART over 1s=1nt=2c=? now 2d starts BART where you can show various hand types, for example opener will show 2-3 h earts and minimum or maximum, etc.


1s=1nt=2d=? as suggested above start with 2nt.

[Kaitlyn S]

The opening example had four diamonds and no club stopper. If the auction starts 1S-1NT-2D, I would raise to 3D (yes, it could be a 4-3 fit, but only if opener is specifically 5-3-3-2 with 2 clubs in which case notrump is a disaster.) If opener wants to bid again, zhe bids a 3-card heart suit (forcing.) If partner is dead minimum, you'll miss a 5-3 heart fit but you'll avoid notrump with a doubleton club in both hands.

BTW, as long as you have a pleasant and also willing to learn partner, you'll enjoy 2/1.

[Vampyr]

Stephen Tu, on 2016-September-10, 07:58, said:

Bid 2nt over 2♣. If opener accepts 3nt is supposed to bid 3♥ along the way with 3H and a hand that prefers to play 4♥ instead of 3nt vs. a hand like yours.

You will miss 3♥ for +140/170 sometimes that standard gets to and play 2nt instead which might score worse. Just have to live with it and hope to win it back on other hands.

This method is a little esoteric; I do not think it is standard. But in any case some 2/1GF players make an exception for 1♠-2♥, and some also for 1♦-2♣.

[wank]

Vampyr, on 2016-September-10, 10:15, said:

This method is a little esoteric; I do not think it is standard. But in any case some 2/1GF players make an exception for 1♠-2♥, and some also for 1♦-2♣.

stephentu's method is standard (and correct).

[Vampyr]

wank, on 2016-September-10, 14:17, said:

stephentu's method is standard (and correct).

LOL if that is correct I am grateful that none of my partners make me play 2/1GF.

[wank]

Vampyr, on 2016-September-11, 01:48, said:

LOL if that is correct I am grateful that none of my partners make me play 2/1GF.

this is a fundamental system choice. unsurprisingly, all systems have strengths as well as weaknesses. yes you've spotted a weakness in 2/1 but you need to appreciate its strengths too.

if you want accuracy in partscores, acol for example, handles this well with 1S-2H-2S-2NT nf invitation.

2/1 prioritises bidding the best game (as opposed to getting to game at all) and getting to slam, so partscore and borderline game hands (invitations) lose accuracy.

as good slam and subtle game auctions are worth bigger swings than good partscore auctions, even allowing for frequency, 2/1 is popular with players who play high level imp events. acol, despite its detractors, has a lot to offer at matchpoints, because the size of the swing is irrelevant and the more important issue is frequency whereby partscores outnumber slams and 3NT is normally a better scoring proposition than a safer but difficult to bid 5m or 5-2 major fit game.

[helene_t]

Stephen's method is indeed standard but some people (Fred once voiced that opinion I think, or maybe it was Justin?) that opener should not show his three-card heart suit. The information leakage from showing the heart fragment is arguable a bigger loss than the occasionally lost heart fit.

I don't believe that playing 1♠-2♥ as less than GF is worth it. 1♠-2♥ is the most cramped 2/1 auction so if anything it needs to be less precise, not more, than other 2/1 auctions. It can't be right that
1♠-2♥
2♠-2nt
is passeble - responder needs to be able to bid 2nt with a strong hand to conserve bidding space.

What you could do is, as Mike777 suggests, to play Bart. Or play
1♠-?
-2♣: gf, clubs or balanced
-2♦: hearts, inv+
-2♥: diamonds (unbalanced), gf