[bowbells]

I am trying to implement standard count, attitude and suit preference into my bridge game but am not clear on certain aspects.

My understanding so far is that the following echo’s mean:

Hi then low = encourage / even number of cards
Low then high = discourage / odd number

I also understand that some partnerships may prefer different order of signals. Ie. attitude then count or count then attitude.

As a newbie I am not sure what order I should play but so far I only play attitude and show my suit preference on discards.

Example:
On partners lead my first discard would signal attitude so a high card would be encourage and a low card would be discourage. I am right in thinking that anything 6+ is considered high?

Say partner has lead king from AK and I am holding Q94 of that suit. I would lay the 9 to encourage the suit. If I was holding 52 doubleton I would lead the 5 to complete the hi-low echo to encourage.

At the moment if I can’t follow suit (opps or partners) my first discard would be to signal suit preference. Is this correct? If I was to lay say the 2,3 or 4 of clubs as a discard then to me that is signalling a spade. Discarding a high club would be asking for club suit.

Regarding count, do I show this on opps lead? If not how do i show this? Hi/low being even, low-hi being odd.

I am sure I am missing a lot here but I have not been able to find any detailed examples of card signalling on the internet. Any links would be appreciated.

Advanced thanks.

[inquiry]

Welcome to the BridgeBase Online Forums. You might want to start with this thread...

http://forums.bridgebase.com/in...ay;threadid=575

Which is entitled Beginners Guide to signaling and Giving Count. In it you will find UDCA, standard, roman (o/e) signals, lavinthal, smith echo, and others...

Or you might just look at a few of the more detailed post in that thread. The following one happened to be one of my post on this subject.
http://forums.bridgebase.com/in...msg3389#msg3389

Ben

[bowbells]

OK I couldnt use the link but have found it via search.

Thanks Ben

[lucky_dom]

A brilliant place to start is worth Learn To Play Bridge 2, by our very own Fred Gitelman. You can access it through 'Explore Bridge' -> 'Learn to Play Bridge' from the BBO lobby. Or you can download it from various places to be able to use it offline, but I can't remember where right now. It covers signalling starting from scratch, so is very useful to anyone starting out, even if you are going to switch to another method of carding afterwards (UDCA, 3/5, whatever).

Dom

[1eyedjack]

Hi bowbells

There are a few books that go into splitting up situations into when one type of signal is preferable over another. If you are not used to count signals at all and are willing to undergo a learning curve it may be an idea to play nothing other than count signals for a few weeks to "get into the mindset", and then, when you have got some practice of them, then start to mix them up. I know a number of excellent players who only play count and suit pref signals.

[bowbells]

Thanks for all the info guys. Appreciated!!

[bearmum]

bowbells, on Jun 11 2004, 02:44 AM, said:

I am trying to implement standard count, attitude and suit preference into my bridge game but am not clear on certain aspects.

My understanding so far is that the following echo’s mean:

Hi then low = encourage / even number of cards
Low then high = discourage / odd number

I also understand that some partnerships may prefer different order of signals. Ie. attitude then count or count then attitude.

As a newbie I am not sure what order I should play but so far I only play attitude and show my suit preference on discards.

Example:
On partners lead my first discard would signal attitude so a high card would be encourage and a low card would be discourage.  I am right in thinking that anything 6+ is considered high?

Say partner has lead king from AK and I am holding Q94 of that suit.  I would lay the 9 to encourage the suit.  If I was holding 52 doubleton I would lead the 5 to complete the hi-low echo to encourage.

At the moment if I can’t follow suit (opps or partners) my first discard would be to signal suit preference.  Is this correct?  If I was to lay say the 2,3 or 4 of clubs as a discard then to me that is signalling a spade.  Discarding a high club would be asking for club suit.

Regarding count, do I show this on opps lead?  If not how do i show this? Hi/low being even, low-hi being odd.

I am sure I am missing a lot here but I have not been able to find any detailed examples of card signalling on the internet.  Any links would be appreciated.

Advanced thanks.

I guess one has to agree what PRIMARY signals you are playing ( for example my reg P and I play COUNT first {and suit freference after that}but another friend and I play COUNT on PARTNERS lead and attitude on opps lead )

Also some play UDCA (upside count and attitude) o/e ( which I have tried to play with NO success so decided to give the flick )

As a novice player I believe ATTITUDE is the easiest to begin with both when following ( HI= I LIKE it partner) and when discarding ( HI card I like this suit LO = I don't like this suit) --- and this also works well in casual partnerships (unless you BOTH know lavinthal discards {for example})

[Trpltrbl]

You can play many different ways, you just have to find what works for you the best.

Mike

[pdmunro]

Bowbells, I believe you are on the right track. It doesn’t make sense to have complicated signals when playing on BBO.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
♦ What is defence all about?

The defenders have two main weapons and two main tasks: Using signals and deduction, defenders aim to work out their partner's high cards and declarer's suit distribution. Knowing partner's high cards you can lead those suits for partner to win her tricks. Knowing declarer's distribution, you can keep the correct cards to win that last trick.

♦ What are the standard signals?

In SAYC, standard carding is:

high = encouraging; low = discouraging;
high-low = even count; low-high = odd count.

♦ So THE question is: When do you use them?

(1) The first trick:

(a) When I lead top of a sequence to the first trick, I need to know if partner has the missing honour. From K Q x x, I lead the K. Partner play the 8. Declarer plays low. Partner is telling me that she has the A.

(b) I lead the K from K Q x x. Partner plays the 8. Declarer wins with the A. Partner is telling me she has a doubleton. Next time I have to play the Q, then give her a ruff.

The standard system is high = encouraging AND high-low = even number. The two ideas complement each other. You have to wait till declarer plays his card before you know whether partner is telling you that they have the missing honour, or that they have a doubleton. Either way, the high card says "Continue the suit partner."


(2) Later during the play:

(a) Partner leads the K from A K x x in a suit. I have Q 7 3. I play the 7. This says, “I have either the missing honour or a doubleton partner.” Partner plays her A, then a small card to my Q. If I don’t play my 7 the first time, she may change suit.

(b) Partner leads the K from A K x x in a suit. I have 7 3 2. I play the 2. I am saying to partner: "I do not have the missing honour (A or Q) for you, and I do not have a doubleton". Believe it or not, partner is supposed to think a bit more and work out what honours I might have in the other suits!


(3) When I am out of a suit and I have to choose a discard.

(a) I have a side suit with A Q 7 3. I discard the 7. This says, I like this suit. This is the signal partner wants to see. Now she knows where my high cards are and she can plan the defence.

(b) Let us say spades are trumps. I have ♦ A Q 2 ♣ 9 6 5 3. Declarer plays spades and I have none left. I throw the C3. That says, “Partner, I don't like ♣'s”. I am asking partner to choose from ♥'s or ♦'s. Partner can use other information, such as the bidding, to determine which of these 2 suits I have. "You will work it out, partner". [Note: ♦ = diamonds]

These are the main signals. They are about 80% of the simple signals I use. They occur every deal you play in defence.

Another most effective signal is

(4) Giving suit preference when giving partner a ruff.

At the first trick to a spade contract, I lead K from ♥ A K 10 3. Partner plays a 9. Partner is telling me that she has the Q or a doubleton. I play the A, and she plays the 4. Now, if I have the ♣A, I play the ♥3. She ruffs. (Declarer must have the Q!) The small card, that ♥3, tells her to come back to my hand via the smaller of the other suits. So she plays a club back to my A, and I can give her another ruff.

If I had the ♦A I would play the ♥10. This would tell her to lead diamonds back to me.

I used to think number (4) was too much to remember, but it comes up surprisingly frequently. When you have worked it out a few times, you get pleased with yourself, and you come to really like it.

(5) Lastly, yes I show count when declarer leads a side suit.

You have to think about this a bit. How does it most help the defence? It is best to play it as often as possible to see the different ways it helps the defence.

One important note. Always try to think of declarer’s likely hand pattern. Say declarer is in a suit contract and has 7321, or 5431, or …. Now when he leads from dummy towards what you suspect is his singleton, then you better put up your ace. This is no time to signal your count.

Peter Munro

[EarlPurple]

You have attitude, count and suit preference signals there to give the right one at the appropriate moment. What you have to decide is, when is it the appropriate moment?

If partner leads out from a solid sequence, it is likely he does not need to know your attitude, but is more likely to want to know how many you have. But if he leads an ace of a suit your side has bid and support, and dummy has a singleton, he may want to know suit-preference, particularly if your side has to cash out. Here is an example;

In a competitive auction, your side has been bidding diamonds, and they have outbid you to 6♥. They haven't checked for aces on the way, because the auction was too competitive - so they might be missing two.

You lead the ace of diamonds and dummy is:

♠ KQJx ♥ KJ9x ♦ x ♣ KQJx

Maybe partner has the ace of clubs or the ace of spades. So what should you lead next? Your partner should know it is obvious you want a suit-preference signal here. You hardly need an attitude signal (you do not need to know if he has the king). You don't care how many diamonds he has. (You might be interested, but it's not your main concern). So here partner can play a low diamond to ask for a club, or a high diamond to ask for a spade.

Declarer might have:

♠ Ax ♥ AQTxxx ♦ xxx ♣ xx

or he might have

♠ xx ♥ AQTxxx ♦ xxx ♣ Ax

[1eyedjack]

pdmunro, on Jun 28 2004, 09:54 AM, said:

(1) The first trick:

(a) When I lead top of a sequence to the first trick, I need to know if partner has the missing honour. From K Q x x, I lead the K. Partner play the 8. Declarer plays low. Partner is telling me that she has the A.

I would place a different emphasis on this.

When I lead top of a sequence to the first trick, I need to know whether or not to continue the suit. An attitude signal will tell me this. A count signal might also tell me this but is less reliable (exceptions might be when dummy has all the missing honours or declarer can be relied upon to win with the only missing one if he holds it). However, assuming an attitude signal, encouragement does not necessarily mean possession of a fitting honour, nor does discouragement deny possession.

If partner cannot work out what is going on, then I suppose that he might as well use possession or absence of a fitting honour as a guide to decide whether to encourage or discourage. More generally, however, he should encourage if he wants a continuation, and discourage if he wants a switch. Possession (or not) of a fitting honour may be relevant to that decision but it certainly need not be conclusive.