[pigpenz]

auction at matchpoints red vs black
1♣ pass 1♦ pas
your call?

Scoring: MP

YOU OPEN THE BIDDING IN FOURTH SEAT AFTER 3 PASSES

---

[pclayton]

I'd add 3♠ to the list, which is what I'll try.

Not too worried about the 4th trump, since I have a fantastic source of tricks.

xxx, Axx, Qxxxx, xx gives us a fair play for slam. Add a 6th diamond or a 3rd club and its downright excellent.

[Blofeld]

I like 3♠ as well.

[mike777]

3s

Playing Walsh partner has denied a 4 card major so why not?
Pard has chosen to not bid 1nt
Pard has chosen to not bid weak 2 or 3 club raise
I like my chances in D.

[coyot]

Noone tries 3NT?
OK, the risk of losing 5 tricks in majors is too big .

2♠ for me, then (I am an exotic creature that plays 1♠ rebid as forcing and 2♠ as splinter - everybody laughs at it, but I still refuse to change).

[P_Marlowe]

Boring.

3C, wtp?

If you dont like the system bid,
play art. reverses as Roland advocates,
or switch the meaning of 2C and 3C, i.e
make 2C forcing, as suggested by Richard
Pavlicek, but please stop posting those hands.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[whereagles]

Yes, 1♣ might get messy. This hand could try open 2NT or 2♣.

[Fluffy]

3♠ would require a 4th ♦, so I will just bid 1♥.

[Gerben42]

Partnership issue: What does partner respond on this?

xxx
xxx
Axx
QJxx

If 1♦ then splinter now is not a good idea!

[pclayton]

When I splinter for diamonds, after I open 1C, do I not promises longer clubs than diamonds?

Gerben, certainly we can find our way to 5C opposite your example hand after a splinter.

Are there pairs that still play 1C - 1N shows 8 - 10 or 11 and 1D is forced on you with a weak 3334? I thought this style went out 15 years ago.

Those that bid 3C on this hand aren't understanding this hand's potential. Opposite the hand I posted earlier, xxx, Axx, Qxxxx, xx, pard will pass 3C when 6 has a play.

[P_Marlowe]

pclayton, on Aug 17 2005, 09:36 AM, said:

When I splinter for diamonds, after I open 1C, do I not promises longer clubs than diamonds?

Gerben, certainly we can find our way to 5C opposite your example hand after a splinter.

Are there pairs that still play 1C - 1N shows 8 - 10 or 11 and 1D is forced on you with a weak 3334? I thought this style went out 15 years ago.

Those that bid 3C on this hand aren't understanding this hand's potential. Opposite the hand I posted earlier, xxx, Axx, Qxxxx, xx, pard will pass 3C when 6 has a play.

Hi,

since you claim 3C bidder dont understand the potential,
I will speak a 2nd time. I know, that 3C can be passed,
... yawn, I know, that the hand is great, so what?

If you dont like 3C, the system bid, and american style, 3C
shows already a solid 6 card suit and +17/18HCP, (how far
aways is this description?) contrary to european / Acol style,
change system, else make the system bid.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[pigpenz]

I myself bid 3♣ at the table, my feeling is that in fourth seat it has to be a pretty good suit to open and jump to three level, geared more to getting to 3nt with the right stoppers in partners suit. All the splinter bids and things like that I can see if you had opened this hand in first or second seat opposite an unpassed hand, but once partner has passed it would seem we should be more interested in getting to 3NT.

[mike777]

pigpenz, on Aug 17 2005, 10:38 AM, said:

I myself bid 3♣ at the table, my feeling is that in fourth seat it has to be a pretty good suit to open and jump to three level, geared more to getting to 3nt with the right stoppers in partners suit.  All the splinter bids and things like that I can see if you had opened this hand in first or second seat opposite an unpassed hand, but once partner has passed it would seem we should be more interested in getting to 3NT.

Ok, all of this is a fair analysis. But partner is still allowed to bid 3nt over our 3s splinter. This is MP not bridge after all .

[luis]

Mps ? 3NT automatic, Hamman's Law Enforced at MPs.

[pclayton]

P_Marlowe, on Aug 17 2005, 06:46 AM, said:

pclayton, on Aug 17 2005, 09:36 AM, said:

When I splinter for diamonds, after I open 1C, do I not promises longer clubs than diamonds?

Gerben, certainly we can find our way to 5C opposite your example hand after a splinter.

Are there pairs that still play 1C - 1N shows 8 - 10 or 11 and 1D is forced on you with a weak 3334? I thought this style went out 15 years ago.

Those that bid 3C on this hand aren't understanding this hand's potential. Opposite the hand I posted earlier, xxx, Axx, Qxxxx, xx, pard will pass 3C when 6 has a play.

Hi,

since you claim 3C bidder dont understand the potential,
I will speak a 2nd time. I know, that 3C can be passed,
... yawn, I know, that the hand is great, so what?

If you dont like 3C, the system bid, and american style, 3C
shows already a solid 6 card suit and +17/18HCP, (how far
aways is this description?) contrary to european / Acol style,
change system, else make the system bid.

With kind regards
Marlowe

Here's a neat little utility called K and R evaluator I like to use (from Jeff Goldsmith's site):

http://www.gg.caltec...u/~jeff/knr.cgi

If you input the subject hand, you'll find the subjective value is 21.25 points.

K and R puts emphasis on long strong suits, and discounts short and unsupported honors. It was started by Edgar Kaplan and Jeff Rubens of the Bridge World.

SO, by this definition, 3♣ is an underbid by over an Ace. And what makes you think 3♣ promises anything close to a solid suit?

[Free]

Keep it simple: 1♥. However it also depends if you play Walsch or not...

[Al_U_Card]

You have to cater to both hands with 3D. Pard will get the idea that 3NT is possible if he has the major suit values to bid once more.

[P_Marlowe]

pclayton, on Aug 17 2005, 11:48 AM, said:

Here's a neat little utility called K and R evaluator I like to use (from Jeff Goldsmith's site):

http://www.gg.caltec...u/~jeff/knr.cgi

If you input the subject hand, you'll find the subjective value is 21.25 points.

K and R puts emphasis on long strong suits, and discounts short and unsupported honors. It was started by Edgar Kaplan and Jeff Rubens of the Bridge World.

SO, by this definition, 3♣ is an underbid by over an Ace. And what makes you think 3♣ promises anything close to a solid suit?

Hi,

in the current context, solid does not mean AKQxxx,
change the wording to good suit.

If you believe the hand is worth 21.25, fine,
thats ok with me, but why did you not open stronger
with 2C or if available in your arsenal with a bid,
showing a semiforcing?

You did not do this in the first place, which is ok,
but this means, you have to accept, that you cant
transmit the information, that your hand is so strong,
at least, unless a fit is found, because you denied
this strength with your opening bid.
=> Because I cant, I wont.

That's all.

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: As I already said, there exist solutions, if you want
to use them, fell free, change system, but until you do,
accept it, that you cant.

[luke warm]

i have to admit i'd bid 3C at the table... i think that's a very good description of my hand... i'm not crazy about splintering with 3 card support for a minor.. had partner bid 1H, and if i had that same support, it might be different (but i doubt it)

[Elianna]

pclayton, on Aug 17 2005, 09:48 AM, said:

Here's a neat little utility called K and R evaluator I like to use (from Jeff Goldsmith's site):

http://www.gg.caltec...u/~jeff/knr.cgi

If you input the subject hand, you'll find the subjective value is 21.25 points.

K and R puts emphasis on long strong suits, and discounts short and unsupported honors. It was started by Edgar Kaplan and Jeff Rubens of the Bridge World.

SO, by this definition, 3♣ is an underbid by over an Ace. And what makes you think 3♣ promises anything close to a solid suit?

I know that we've been on this merry-go-round before but I don't think that K and R is a useful tool past opening bid. In fact, past 2nd chair. It evaluates hands in absentia of previous bidding. For example, if RHO bids spades, Kxx is worth more than if LHO had bid spades.