[Swammerdam]

Nobody is vulnerable. Partner deals. You hold

QT Q97 AJ753 T65

The bidding proceeds

1♠ 2♣ P. P.
2♥ P. 2♠ 3♣
3♥ 4♣ ?

Do you approve of your bidding so far? What call do you make now?

[Huibertus]

I would have doubled 2♣, correcting 2♥ to 2♠ preferring 5-2 fits over 4-3 fits, raising 2NT (should not just be a balanced minimum opening with a stop).

Although you haven't found a fit yet this hand looks to be your part score at least. What does 3♥ mean? If it promises 5♥ I'm bidding 4♥. If it is a game try for ♠, I'm going to try protect our score rather then risking going down lacking trumps in ♥ or ♠.

If this is match points I'd risk doubling 4♣ as they will have their ♣ tricks but have no source of trick elsewhere. It could be wrong if they have a cross ruff. At IMPs I'd silently swear at myself for my pass and pass again hoping this only is a minor part score swing with us making a ♥ or ♠ part score and ♣ being 1/2 down.

[DavidKok]

I don't approve of the bidding so far. I would also have doubled 2♣ the first time. Also without seeing the hand, I dislike the delayed club raise by LHO, and the self-raise to 4♣ by RHO.
I can't fault partner's bidding - they're showing a minimum 5-5 hand, and I presume that's what they are holding. Keep in mind that 2♥ was not forcing, so with noticeable extras I expect partner to either double (risking a trap pass, but more commonly describing the hand next round after) or directly jump bid 3♥.

Our hand has become more valuable - those major suit queens have gained in value. We also have huge undisclosed extras, as our current bidding is compatible with 0 HCP (though this is not a likely scenario). Unfortunately we've failed to describe our hand at a safe level, despite the helpful lack of a club raise, so now we have to take a risky decision ourselves.
If partner has a hand like ♠AJxxx, ♥AKxxx, ♦xx, ♣x our 4♥ is excellent, and even opposite the weaker ♠AJxxx, ♥KJTxx, ♦xx, ♣x (would you open this?) we have chances. There is also a chance that our expert(?) opponents have their implied 10 card club fit - on the auction we're broadcasting a 7 card spade fit and possible 8 card heart fit, so bidding 4-over-3 is generally a losing proposition with only 9 trumps (in fact, it's not great with 10 trumps either). This gives partner a club void and makes game more probable, e.g. ♠A9xxx, ♥KJTxx, ♦Qxx, ♣- is a very good 4♥.
I think I'll bid 4♥, and apologise for my lack of earlier action. If we double first round I think that reduces our problems considerably.

P.S. 3♥ can't be a game try for spades in my opinion - we don't have a confirmed fit, and partner had 3♣ available as a game try. I hope this isn't a "look at how poorly my partner bid" thread - so far they're the only one I can't find fault with on this deal, assuming they do have the 5-5.

[Huibertus]

DavidKok, on 2025-May-25, 04:35, said:

Also without seeing the hand, I dislike the delayed club raise by LHO

I couldn't agree more. One of the most frequent mistakes made here. Raise to the level you want to go at the first opportunity and shut up thereafter, it simply makes life harder for the opponents.

[Swammerdam]

For the record, the "You" in OP was the alleged "Expert." (I was his partner.) I posted this hand hoping for confirmation that his bidding lacked expertise.


His initial Pass over 2♣ may have been his 4th-best option; and his mere correction to 2♠ on the next round (keeping his support AND high cards hidden) is also doubtful.
BUT it is his THIRD call -- the one shown as just "?" -- that I found hugely wrong. With support for BOTH my suits AND the Ace♦ I think he should come to life, pprobably with a 4♥ bid. I must have 5-5, 6-5 or 5-6 for my bidding. But instead of supporting my suit he said Double! What is he doubling 4♣ on?? Bad clubs, an Ace and little else? His partner's bids promise shape rather than great high cards. Any Kings partner has may be useless since the opponents figure to be shapely as well.

Anyway we played 4♣ doubled. What is your opening lead? 4♣ can be defeated BUT not after the opening lead that "Expert" chose.

I will show my hand in a follow-up. I expect that my bidding will be criticized as well!

DavidKok, on 2025-May-25, 04:35, said:

I don't approve of the bidding so far. I would also have doubled 2♣ the first time.

Double implies four hearts. Would you correct 2♥ to 2♠ implying that you are 2-3 in the majors? That sounds like a very good plan.
And 2♦ and 2♠ are also possible (though not as good as Double). (Gambling with a 2-card raise in competition is sometimes least of evils, no?)
Pass seems like a poor choice since your action will be even more difficult on the next round.

DavidKok, on 2025-May-25, 04:35, said:

Also without seeing the hand, I dislike the delayed club raise by LHO, and the self-raise to 4♣ by RHO.
...
I can't fault partner's bidding - they're showing a minimum 5-5 hand, and I presume that's what they are holding. Keep in mind that 2♥ was not forcing, so with noticeable extras I expect partner to either double (risking a trap pass, but more commonly describing the hand next round after) or directly jump bid 3♥.

I do have a shapely 13-count and considered 3♥, but I tend to be a conservative bidder.
OF COURSE 2♥ is non-forcing and 3♥ would be non-forcing as well. I didn't open 2♣ and partner has promised only Zero HCP; AFAIK it is impossible (and illogical) for me to force.

DavidKok, on 2025-May-25, 04:35, said:

Our hand has become more valuable - those major suit queens have gained in value. We also have huge undisclosed extras, as our current bidding is compatible with 0 HCP (though this is not a likely scenario). Unfortunately we've failed to describe our hand at a safe level, despite the helpful lack of a club raise, so now we have to take a risky decision ourselves.
If partner has a hand like ♠AJxxx, ♥AKxxx, ♦xx, ♣x our 4♥ is excellent, and even opposite the weaker ♠AJxxx, ♥KJTxx, ♦xx, ♣x (would you open this?) we have chances. There is also a chance that our expert(?) opponents have their implied 10 card club fit - on the auction we're broadcasting a 7 card spade fit and possible 8 card heart fit, so bidding 4-over-3 is generally a losing proposition with only 9 trumps (in fact, it's not great with 10 trumps either). This gives partner a club void and makes game more probable, e.g. ♠A9xxx, ♥KJTxx, ♦Qxx, ♣- is a very good 4♥.
I think I'll bid 4♥, and apologise for my lack of earlier action. If we double first round I think that reduces our problems considerably.

P.S. 3♥ can't be a game try for spades in my opinion - we don't have a confirmed fit, and partner had 3♣ available as a game try. I hope this isn't a "look at how poorly my partner bid" thread - so far they're the only one I can't find fault with on this deal, assuming they do have the 5-5.

I think both 4♥ and 4♠ make easily. (Is it possible for me to see results at other tables after I left the table where I played the hand?)
And I agree that 3♥ is a natural bid showing five or more hearts. Note that even with the 2♠ correction, "Expert" is still promising only Zero points.

[mike777]

 Swammerdam, on 2025-May-25, 03:19, said:

Nobody is vulnerable. Partner deals. You hold

QT Q97 AJ753 T65

The bidding proceeds

1♠ 2♣ P. P.
2♥ P. 2♠ 3♣
3♥ 4♣ ?

Do you approve of your bidding so far? What call do you make now?

As others mentioned making a negative double and converting back to spades is reasonable.
Another option is bidding an immediate two spades with QT of spades.

[DavidKok]

Swammerdam, on 2025-May-25, 07:26, said:

Anyway we played 4♣ doubled. What is your opening lead? 4♣ can be defeated BUT not after the opening lead that "Expert" chose.

A small club. I think playing partner for a singleton in diamonds so I can give a ruff is against the odds, and I don't see what we gain from leading a major suit right away. It's not like they can pitch major suit losers on the diamonds easily.

Swammerdam, on 2025-May-25, 07:26, said:

Double implies four hearts. Would you correct 2♥ to 2♠ implying that you are 2-3 in the majors? That sounds like a very good plan.
And 2♦ and 2♠ are also possible (though not as good as Double). (Gambling with a 2-card raise in competition is sometimes least of evils, no?)
Pass seems like a poor choice since your action will be even more difficult on the next round.

Yes, if partner bids 2♥ I will correct to spades. If partner jump bids in hearts I'm not so sure - partner could have a strong 5=4 (when we likely want to be in spades, so partner doesn't get shortened by forced club ruffs), 6=4 (definitely spades) or 5=5 (definitely hearts). Still I prefer double to 2♦.
I consider 2♠ worse than pass. I don't lie about (lack of) support on competitive auctions, ever. It might be good some of the time, but I'm not skilled enough to identify when that is the case. What's more, I bid aggressively and expect my partners to do the same, and one of the more painful ways to get punished for that is by upgrading a shape hand with fit only to find out the support isn't as good as you'd expected. The more shape-oriented you bid, the higher the downside of faking support.

[WasWinM]

Late to reply but pass is the only reasonable call IMO.
Later I raise to 4h. It’s hard to imagine a better fitting hand that passed originally. Both queens hace gone up greatly in value and I have an ace not just random points.

[mikeh]

It appears as if I’m in a minority of one…not for the first time.

Ok….first round….1S (2C) to me.

I am 2=3=5=3 with 9 hcp. For me double shows 4+ hearts and denies 3+ spades. If I knew that the auction would continue, over my double, as P 2H p and I was trying to win the board in the bidding…I’d double.

Unfortunately I’m not one of those players who thinks he knows what will happen. I’m one of those players who likes partner not to be unpleasantly surprised when the auction becomes competitive and he bids on the assumption that I hold something that accords with my bidding. Say LHO raised to 3C. I want partner to feel free to bid 3H on a minimum 5431, as one example….and while I’m not the least bit shy about playing 4-3 fits, I hate playing 4-3 fits when the 4 card holding is going to be tapped early. Heck, we may be in a tapped out 4=3 heart contract with a bullet proof 6=2 spade partial available.

So, since any positive call by me lies to partner and because my pass is not remotely close to a final decision…I pass. Btw, while this hand isn’t a significant factor in my decision…say opener holds Jxxxx AKx Kx Qxx. Your call after 1S (2C) x (p).

Ok…opener reopened 2H.

My hand has improved. He won’t have a big hand but he can definitely hold some extra values, so game is possible.

What are our choices?

Pass? I hate it. Yes, it could work out when he has a minimum without good suits…say K10xxx AJxx Ax xx, but would/should he reopen?

What about K10xxx AJxxx Kx x? I think he has to reopen, especially at mps (I don’t know the form of scoring).

But why can’t he have say AKJxx AKxxx xx x? Game is good in either major and tge one thing we can say about passing 2H is that we’re never reaching game.

Most players are familiar with bidding 2D with, say, 5=3=2=3 9 hcp after an uncontested 1D 1S 2C….not because we think 2D is a better part score than 2C but because 2C is very wide range in standard methods and our 9 count means we may be cold for a game…so the false preference may cost a partial but may gain us a game.

While this auction isn’t precisely analogous, it’s similar enough that I think that the false preference of 2S is clear….so long as we do it in tempo…a slow 2S is basically letting everyone know that we are 2=3 majors.

LHO helps us here by making a common mistake, made hundreds of times a day around the world. One either bids over 2C or one shuts the f**k up absent partner taking further action.

Opener made a 3H bid. The OP says we may criticize his bidding later, but let’s wait and see. From here, it suggests something like a decent 15 count with 5-5 majors (may be a touch lighter with, say, 6-5).

In any event, I’m bidding 4H whether RHO offers 4C or a pass. I have 3 working cards and haven’t yet shown any of them. Partner should be and almost certainly was playing me for one or (on a good day) two useful values, if only because of the auction, but he’s not playing me for this hand. In fact, while I wasn’t expecting a delayed 3C bid I did expect partner to bid 3H anyway with a decent 5=5.. indeed, as noted above, it’s precisely to allow him to do so that I bid 2S.

More…say he had not bid 3H over 3C….it comes back to me……I’m bidding 3H now….which paints an almost perfect picture of my hand. If he’s a trick too light to bid 3H, he will often be ok in 3M anyway.

[Swammerdam]

I took a screen dump that shows the hands and auction. Is it possible to upload an image from my laptop? (I do see how to load from https://, but I don't use Cloud etc.)
I MIGHT be able to figure out hand editor, but it would be much faster (though much less aesthetic) to just type in all four hands.

I'll wait for advice on this before presenting the other hands.

We have one vote for Opening Lead = small club. Any other votes?

[HardVector]

I couldn't agree more with Mikeh's assessment, you are no longer alone. This hand initially has the hallmarks of hands I am constantly telling students about with the phrase "Beware the misfits". Later on, when you have established that a fit exists, you can come to life.