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Robots bidding like novices Robot bidding not as good as previously

#1 User is offline   goldfolk 

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Posted 2021-December-09, 06:09

Has anybody else noticed that the robot bidding seems to be a lot worse recently; for example:

Robot held x
xx
QJx
AKQxxxx

Robot opened 1 club, 2H overcall, double from me, pass 3C from robot, pass, 3NT from me, pass, 5C from robot. 3NT makes 10 tricks and 5C goes 2 off.

On a second occasion I doubled a 3H pre-empt on my right and left robot bid 4H and the robot passed with a 4-2-2-5 12 count with 4S an easy make.

Just wondering if anybody else has had similar issues because while I don't expect the robots to play like geniuses and they do have certain well-known foibles I do expect them to know the basics.
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#2 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2021-December-09, 13:22

The robots haven't been touched in years. I don't think they've gotten worse, but they frustratingly consistently make the same mistakes. (It's possible the play has gotten a bit worse due to the server load resulting in less time to calculate, but not bidding database issues like these.)
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#3 User is offline   Butchie T 

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Posted 2021-December-10, 02:13

Robots don't seem to react well to doubles and robots will rarely allow a closeout 3NT bid to stand. They often push to ridiculous slams.
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#4 User is offline   Peter_f 

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Posted 2021-December-10, 05:50

I often wish for an aggressivity controller for robots, e.g. from 1-9.
Then I would turn this down from nine (current position) to four or five.
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#5 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-December-10, 21:58

View Postsmerriman, on 2021-December-09, 13:22, said:

The robots haven't been touched in years. I don't think they've gotten worse, but they frustratingly consistently make the same mistakes. (It's possible the play has gotten a bit worse due to the server load resulting in less time to calculate, but not bidding database issues like these.)


In stark contrast to just about every other computer based online game with the possible exceptions of Pong, Snake and Tetris.
Mind you Snake is still pretty tough - you can play it in your browser here: https://playsnake.org/


All the same, they still bid and play better than most.
Robot+robot regularly score well in tournaments.
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#6 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2021-December-11, 10:36

View Postpilowsky, on 2021-December-10, 21:58, said:

Robot+robot regularly score well in tournaments.

This is often repeated here, but it's not my experience from club tournaments: they average below halfway at MP against modest but regular human partnerships. Of course they do better against casual pickup pairs or regular pairs that are still unused to robot opponents. It wouldn't be surprising either if robots get along better with a robot partner than with the average human partner.
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#7 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-December-11, 16:05

I thought GIB had a decent albeit not fantastic position on the EBU NGS.
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#8 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2021-December-11, 16:24

View Postpilowsky, on 2021-December-11, 16:05, said:

I thought GIB had a decent albeit not fantastic position on the EBU NGS.


I don't know and am curious: I looked at the 2021 pairs ranking but found only EBU humans, including a familiar pair at an impressive 60.75%, but no robots.
Maybe someone from EBU can enlighten us here.
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#9 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-December-11, 18:14

View Postpescetom, on 2021-December-11, 16:24, said:

I don't know and am curious: I looked at the 2021 pairs ranking but found only EBU humans, including a familiar pair at an impressive 60.75%, but no robots.
Maybe someone from EBU can enlighten us here.

From this thread on the other site - https://bridgewinner...ots-ngs-rating/

https://www.ebu.co.uk/ngs/DIU/M/I
25.Basic BBO Bot A55.98J
26.Advanced BBO Bot B55.92J

Looks like the Basic Bot is slightly ahead ATM.
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#10 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2021-December-12, 17:13

View Postpilowsky, on 2021-December-11, 18:14, said:

From this thread on the other site - https://bridgewinner...ots-ngs-rating/

https://www.ebu.co.uk/ngs/DIU/M/I
25.Basic BBO Bot A55.98J
26.Advanced BBO Bot B55.92J

Looks like the Basic Bot is slightly ahead ATM.


Thanks, that's interesting although limited to one club and rather ambiguous.
What I was commenting on was the the performance of a pair of basic bots: I don't doubt that a skilled human botmaster can do well with an advanced bot.
As often, I fail to understand the comment of Robin Barker.
I can't see anything about BBO robots in the current overall NGS data.
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#11 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-December-12, 17:58

View Postpescetom, on 2021-December-12, 17:13, said:

Thanks, that's interesting although limited to one club and rather ambiguous.
What I was commenting on was the the performance of a pair of basic bots: I don't doubt that a skilled human botmaster can do well with an advanced bot.
As often, I fail to understand the comment of Robin Barker.
I can't see anything about BBO robots in the current overall NGS data.


Maybe they decided to be anonymous.
Perhaps Gordon can assist?
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#12 User is offline   9NTredbl 

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Posted 2021-December-24, 20:10

No.
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#13 User is offline   pilowsky 

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Posted 2021-December-24, 22:40

Botmaster or robot wrangler?
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#14 User is offline   thepossum 

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Posted 2022-January-11, 01:14

How many games does it take in official Bridge circles for individuals or pairs to get a meaningful ranking?

Curious because I've been trying to rank me and Gib for a few years now
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#15 User is offline   ehaa9488 

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Posted 2022-May-30, 13:49

robot hand JT64 AT643 983 3
Auction goes 1C by robot partner, 1S, neg dbl, 2C, 2D, P, 2S, 3H, P and the robot with a 5cd h suit and a 5 cnt with 3 diamonds to the 9 bids 4 DIAAMONDS. On what planet is this ever right - the height of root stupidity!!!
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#16 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2022-May-31, 10:51

View Postehaa9488, on 2022-May-30, 13:49, said:

robot hand JT64 AT643 983 3
Auction goes 1C by robot partner, 1S, neg dbl, 2C, 2D, P, 2S, 3H, P and the robot with a 5cd h suit and a 5 cnt with 3 diamonds to the 9 bids 4 DIAAMONDS. On what planet is this ever right - the height of root stupidity!!!

It's hard to tell which robot is doing what bidding -- please post a proper hand diagram or a link to the hand record.

Also, we have a GIB Robot Discussion forum where you can post questions like this. Or use the Robot Report menu item from history.

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