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Live Games Wrong Bids

#1 User is offline   Spock_ 

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  Posted 2021-April-09, 07:16

If you write a bid that is obviously wrong in a live game whats the situation? Some say you have a chance to correct it - other say you simply must wear it. I have no training as a director. :unsure:
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#2 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2021-April-09, 09:29

This is explained in LAW 25 - LEGAL AND ILLEGAL CHANGES OF CALL

Quote

A. Unintended Call
1. If a player discovers that he has not made the call he intended to make, he may, until his
partner makes a call, substitute the call he intended for the unintended call. The second
(intended) call stands and is subject to the appropriate Law, but the lead restrictions in Law
26 do not apply.
2. If the player’s original intent was to make the call selected or voiced, that call stands. A
change of call may be allowed because of a mechanical error or a slip of the tongue, but not
because of a loss of concentration regarding the intent of the action.
3. A player is allowed to replace an unintended call if the conditions described in A1 above are
met, no matter how he may have become aware of his error.
4. No substitution of call may be made when his partner has made a subsequent call.
5. If the auction ends before it reaches the player’s partner no substitution may occur after
the end of the auction period (see Law 17D).
6. If a substitution is allowed the LHO may withdraw any call he made over the first call.
Information from the withdrawn call is authorized to his side and unauthorized to the
opponents.
B. Call Intended
1. A substituted call not permitted by A may be accepted by the offender’s LHO. (It is accepted
if LHO calls intentionally over it.) The first call is then withdrawn, the second call stands and
the auction continues (Law 26 may apply).
2. Except as in B1, a substitution not permitted by A is cancelled. The original call stands and
the auction continues (Law 26 may apply).
3. Law 16C applies to any call withdrawn or cancelled.


#3 User is offline   mycroft 

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Posted 2021-April-09, 09:57

Law 25 is your answer - at least where technology doesn't limit:

Quote

LAW 25 - LEGAL AND ILLEGAL CHANGES OF CALL
A. Unintended Call
  • If a call is made by a player that was not intended and if it is discovered before partner makes a call, it may be substituted with the intended call. The second (intended) call stands and is subject to the appropriate Law, but the lead restrictions in Law 26 do not apply.
  • If the player’s original intent was to make the call selected or voiced, that call stands. A change of call may be allowed because of a mechanical error or a slip of the tongue, but not because of a loss of concentration regarding the intent of the action.
  • A player is allowed to replace an unintended call if the conditions described in A1 above are met, no matter how the error came to the player’s attention.
  • No substitution of call may be made when partner has made a subsequent call.
  • If the auction ends before it reaches the player’s partner no substitution may occur after the end of the auction period (see Law 17D).
  • If a substitution is allowed the LHO may withdraw a call made over the first call. Information from the withdrawn call is authorized to this side and unauthorized to the opponents.

B. Call Intended
  • A substituted call not permitted by A may be accepted by the offender’s LHO. (It is accepted if LHO calls intentionally over it.) The first call is then withdrawn, the second call stands and
    the auction continues (Law 26 may apply).
  • Except as in B1, a substitution not permitted by A is cancelled. The original call stands and the auction continues (Law 26 may apply).
  • Law 16C applies to any call withdrawn or cancelled.

(my emphasis of the critical sections)

So, "obviously wrong" is not at all relevant (though it may be evidence). The question is "intended" or "unintended" - did the person, as they were making the call, want to make that call (whether because system forget, didn't see the opening bid, thinking "I need to show my spades" and bidding spades instead of a heart transfer, thinking "not enough aces for slam" when passing instead of returning to the trump suit,...) or were they intending to make one call and another one came out (my famous online is an opening pass explained as "12-14" - clearly, I clicked 1; entered my explanation; then hit pass instead of NT. Offline, did you know it's not legal to double your partner out of turn? Of course, when it was pointed out to me, I apologized, put the double back and pulled the blue Alert card that is behind it.)

There's also timing issues where, even if it was totally not what you meant to pull, you don't get to change it; and issues about information (authorized and unauthorized). That's what the director is for.

Unintended played cards (and unintended shown but not played cards) are a totally different law with totally different conditions on whether it can be changed.

Technology limitations - Many games are run "no undos". If that's the case, tough luck. If there are undos, they're intended to allow L25A changes, and using it for "changed your mind" call is considered abuse (and likely will lead to future undo requests not being granted). In ACBL tournaments (not club games) on BBO, the policy is to ask for the undo and call the TD; the TD will come and determine if she believes it is a 25A situation or not; if it is, she will request the opponents to accept the undo. There are many ways that process can fail, but it's the closest we can get to what happens IRL as we can get with current BBO technology.
When I go to sea, don't fear for me, Fear For The Storm -- Birdie and the Swansong (tSCoSI)
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#4 User is offline   0 carbon 

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Posted 2021-April-29, 16:16

Use Undo button
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