[keithhus]

Would appreciate advice regarding whether one should ever make rescue bids (not sacrificial bids) In my recent attempts I have gone down miserably. Thank you

[neilkaz]

keithhus, on 2015-February-11, 13:53, said:

Would appreciate advice regarding whether one should ever make rescue bids (not sacrificial bids) In my recent attempts I have gone down miserably. Thank you

Please show us an example hand. One per post please. Please start with the one that concerns you the most. You'll get several replies, and then, if you wish, please show another hand that bothers you.

[aguahombre]

Agree with NeilKaz, above. However, a general thought on the subject: Don't bid for rescue or fright.

[diana_eva]

keithhus, on 2015-February-11, 13:53, said:

Would appreciate advice regarding whether one should ever make rescue bids (not sacrificial bids) In my recent attempts I have gone down miserably. Thank you

I think in most cases you have to think of whether partner is aware of the risks when he makes a bid. For example if your partner bids all by himself a natural suit over opponents' strong 1NT, and he gets doubled. He surely was aware of this possibility, yet he made the bid anyway. No need to rescue him there.

[gwnn]

Without seeing the hands I obviously cannot help you a lot but when opps double me or my partner and they seem to know what they are doing, I often run and usually it works out. It all depends on your table feel and the alternative (where you can run). Of course it could lead to good opps doubling you speculatively but in practice most people don't and it is very risky if all they hope for is me running (what if I have nowhere to run?). Then again, I recently pulled 3NTx to 4C when 3NT would have made with 2 overtricks so take this with a grain of salt.

[Zelandakh]

It depends what you mean by rescue bids. Most people associate this term with pulling unecessarily and therefore such calls have a very poor reputation. However, things like taking out into a major after a 1NT opening with a long suit and not much else can also be described as rescue bids, even more so if 1NT has been doubled. The point is that there are times when the odds favour your playing in your own suit and times when the best thing is just to shut up and accept that you cannot make things any better. As others have already written, perhaps best is to provide examples.

[keithhus]

One hand I recall as opener was:-
S xx
H Kx
D AQJxx
C. Jxxx

I opened 1D; partner responded 1NT (6-9/may or may not be balanced.)
I felt that I should not leave him in NT but felt it better to bid 2D rather than be left in 2 C. Went down by 2 .

As it turned out, partner was balanced -I.e.
S. KJx
H. Qxxx
D. xxx
C. xxx

You may say I bid incorrectly and perhaps should have passed/shown my Cs but my question is more about my thinking - I.e. Whilst I suspected I would not make 2D I did not want to leave my partner in A contract I did not think he would make.

[helene_t]

Partner should have bid 1h. 1nt denies a four card major.

I think it is right to bid 2c since you know you have a minor suit fit.

[keithhus]

helene_t, on 2015-February-12, 11:39, said:

Partner should have bid 1h. 1nt denies a four card major.

I think it is right to bid 2c since you know you have a minor suit fit.

I agree about the H response but as that did not happen, and therefore given what I know, am I right to take out of NT even though I don ' t think I will make it or should I leave and take any consequences. It's the principle (if there is one) I'm aiming at rather than the specific. Thank you.

[keithhus]

keithhus, on 2015-February-12, 12:02, said:

I agree about the H response but as that did not happen, and therefore given what I know, am I right to take out of NT even though I don ' t think I will make it or should I leave and take any consequences. It's the principle (if there is one) I'm aiming at rather than the specific. Thank you.

I should have added that had I received a H response, I would have bid 2 clubs.

[akwoo]

keithhus, on 2015-February-12, 11:29, said:

One hand I recall as opener was:-
S xx
H Kx
D AQJxx
C. Jxxx

I opened 1D; partner responded 1NT (6-9/may or may not be balanced.)
I felt that I should not leave him in NT but felt it better to bid 2D rather than be left in 2 C. Went down by 2 .

As it turned out, partner was balanced -I.e.
S. KJx
H. Qxxx
D. xxx
C. xxx

You may say I bid incorrectly and perhaps should have passed/shown my Cs but my question is more about my thinking - I.e. Whilst I suspected I would not make 2D I did not want to leave my partner in A contract I did not think he would make.

2♦ is the right bid. (And I think it's fine for partner to have bid 1N, even though 1♥ is the system bid.) I think 1N generally goes down exactly as much as 2♦ with these hands. If both spades are offside, 1N could easily be down 3 or 4. (I would consider 2♣ only in a partnership where the 2♣ bid promised at least 5♦.)

Duplicate bridge provides a great life lesson, which is not to judge your decisions by how they turned out, but rather to judge them by how they turned out compared to how else they could have turned out.

[Stephen Tu]

keithhus, on 2015-February-12, 11:29, said:

One hand I recall as opener was:-
S xx
H Kx
D AQJxx
C. Jxxx

I opened 1D; partner responded 1NT (6-9/may or may not be balanced.)

1nt is supposed to usually be balanced. The only time it is really unbalanced is if partner has long clubs but is not strong enough to bid 2c, which varies depending on system. Otherwise if unbalanced partner will be able to bid a major (by far most frequent), or raise diamonds.

Quote

I felt that I should not leave him in NT but felt it better to bid 2D rather than be left in 2 C. Went down by 2 .

- It's perfectly reasonable to pull 1nt, the opps supposedly have a double fit in the majors and might be able to cash a lot of them in 1nt.
- But you should definitely bid 2♣, not 2♦. Partner can easily have only 2 diamonds, and 4, 5, even 6 clubs. Might even have 1 diamond and 6 clubs. Bidding 2♦ is quite poor, because anytime you belong in diamonds not clubs, partner will take a preference back to diamonds. So there's never any case where bidding 2♦ is going to get you to a clearly better fit than bidding 2♣, while 2♣ can find a lot of 8/9 card fits when you only have a 7 card diamond fit.
- partner should have bid 1♥ with the 4 card major. 1nt is supposed to deny a 4 card major in most natural systems.
- 1nt is also fairly likely to go down 2 or more, so it's not at all clear that you really lost anything by being in 2♦. Plus the opponents can probably make 3 spades. It's only really a bad result if vulnerable at MPs.

This situation isn't one I'd normally classify as a "rescue" situation. It's just a normal constructive bidding decision. Rescue situations are normally when the opps have doubled your contract for penalty or passed a takeout double for penalty, and you are contemplating running to someplace better. The things you should be thinking about when trying to change the strain:
- am I fairly certain another strain is going to take more tricks/score better?
- if I have to change the level of the bid to correct the strain, is it likely to score 2+ more tricks, since then you'll have to take more?
- can I change the strain with non-forcing bids? If your bids to strain are forcing, you want to be low enough or strong enough to be able to stop someplace non-ridiculous if your attempt just results in the same spot a level higher. e.g. with 60xx, partner opens 2♥, spades might be better but 2♠ is forcing for a lot of people so passing 2♥ is often best since 2♠ will often just elicit 3♥.
- am I doubled yet? If in a misfit it's often best to stop bidding as low as possible before it's obvious for the opps to double you. Plus in a misfit it's not likely that other contracts really improve matters.
- how do I know that my suit is really better than partner's? Maybe you should allow him to run if he thinks he's in a bad spot and there might be an alternative?
- has my partner shown a weak hand with a long suit? In misfit cases you almost always want to play in the weaker hand's long suit, so that the weak hand can take some tricks with it as trumps, along with whatever high cards you have.
- 2nt, in a constructive auction (as opposed to in competition, where it might be showing minors, or scrambling to find a place to play after a takeout double of 2s or the like), is a strong bid looking for 3nt based on high card power, it is not a bid to be utilized to just show lack of fit. If you find yourself at the 2 level in a misfit hand, without the strength for game, you are best off just trying to get to whatever best 5/2, 4/3, 6/1, 6/0 trump fit you have at the 2 level by passing or taking a preference and trying to scramble as many tricks as possible. Don't bid 2nt with weakish responding hands or minimum openers just because you don't fit partner.

[Stephen Tu]

akwoo, on 2015-February-12, 12:14, said:

(I would consider 2♣ only in a partnership where the 2♣ bid promised at least 5♦.)

I can't see how this is right at all. 1nt bidder can have short diamonds and long clubs. And easily 2 diamonds and 4+ clubs. The only case where there is remotely an issue is if responder is 2-3 in the minors, and doesn't want to pull back to 2♦ in case opener is say 5-5 in the minors or is of the occasionally open 1d with 4-5 in the minors school. But with 2-3 in the minors they wouldn't have responded 1nt in the first place, they have at least one 4 card major!

[akwoo]

Stephen Tu, on 2015-February-12, 12:26, said:

I can't see how this is right at all. 1nt bidder can have short diamonds and long clubs. And easily 2 diamonds and 4+ clubs. The only case where there is remotely an issue is if responder is 2-3 in the minors, and doesn't want to pull back to 2♦ in case opener is say 5-5 in the minors or is of the occasionally open 1d with 4-5 in the minors school. But with 2-3 in the minors they wouldn't have responded 1nt in the first place, they have at least one 4 card major!

I think, if 2♣ could very well be 4-5, then partner would pass 2♣ with ♦xxx ♣KQx.

[helene_t]

Yes but partner shouldn't have 3-3 in the minors. He could be 4-4 but then it might not mattet and he might bid 2d. Otoh if he has six clubs and one diamond, 2d is really poor

[keithhus]

Thank you all for your responses

[wank]

it's a simple game. 1nt denied a major. to make partner's hands contain 13 cards he perforce has a minor. you bid 2c to see if that minor is clubs so you will make them trumps.

this has nothing to do with rescuing partner though. you're just describing your hand to find the best fit/contract.

[ggwhiz]

keithhus, on 2015-February-12, 11:29, said:

I felt that I should not leave him in NT but felt it better to bid 2D rather than be left in 2 C. Went down by 2 .

I would concentrate on quantity rather than quality with this hand and always bid 2♣, on the best day catching partner with 3-3-2-5 shape and they will (almost) always pick the best minor to play in.

You went down 2 in 2♦ but 1nt rates to go down at least as many and if you got a poor score here it was caused by poor defense or overbidding by pairs in the other direction.