[Kungsgeten]

In the symmetric relay system notes I've found, 2C over a 1M opening is a GF relay. They, however, also have an opening bid showing 5-5 majors, so this hand isn't included in the 1S opening.

I've seen people playing 1M-2C as GF relay, without using the 5-5 majors opening. Does anyone have notes for a scheme like this? The symmetric relay I'm talking about is something like:

1S-2C;
2D = 5440 or 4+ clubs
2H = 4+ diamonds
2S = 4 hearts
2NT+ = 6+ spades or 5332

I guess one way would be this below, but I guess there might be a better solution:

1S-2C;
2D = 5440, 5-5 majors or 4+ clubs
..2H = R
....2S = 5440 or 5-5 majors
......2N = R
........3C = 5440 (then 3D asks)
........3D+ = 5-5 majors

[straube]

We've given up on the 5440. I suppose we could get it if we lose a step elsewhere.

1S-2C
.....2D-various
..........2H-ask
...............2S-4 diamonds
...............2N-5C
...............3C-5332s
...............etc-5D
.....2H-4H
..........2S-ask
...............2N-5H
...............etc-4H
.....2S-4C
.....etc-6S single-suited

Lots of ways arrange these.

[Kungsgeten]

Okay, so I guess you remove 5440 hands (what do you bid with these hands, pretend they're 5431?) and two 5332 distributions are shown higher than normal, but you gain one step when holding single suiters with 6+ major.

I have some notes from Fredin-Lindkvist and they seemed to combine short and long legged two-suiters like this, starting at 3D: 5431, 5521, 5530, 6421, 6430, 6520, 7420. I'm not sure I like this, since you get quite high with 64. On the other hand you're a step lower than normal with 5431, which is good since it is so common.

[akhare]

Kungsgeten, on 2013-August-16, 18:20, said:

Okay, so I guess you remove 5440 hands (what do you bid with these hands, pretend they're 5431?) and two 5332 distributions are shown higher than normal, but you gain one step when holding single suiters with 6+ major.

I have some notes from Fredin-Lindkvist and they seemed to combine short and long legged two-suiters like this, starting at 3D: 5431, 5521, 5530, 6421, 6430, 6520, 7420. I'm not sure I like this, since you get quite high with 64. On the other hand you're a step lower than normal with 5431, which is good since it is so common.

That's an interesting idea, but it seems better to reorder as 5431, 6421, 5521, followed by the more likely shapes for 3N and above.

[the hog]

Kungsgeten, on 2013-August-16, 07:31, said:

In the symmetric relay system notes I've found, 2C over a 1M opening is a GF relay. They, however, also have an opening bid showing 5-5 majors, so this hand isn't included in the 1S opening.

I've seen people playing 1M-2C as GF relay, without using the 5-5 majors opening. Does anyone have notes for a scheme like this? The symmetric relay I'm talking about is something like:

1S-2C;
2D = 5440 or 4+ clubs
2H = 4+ diamonds
2S = 4 hearts
2NT+ = 6+ spades or 5332

I guess one way would be this below, but I guess there might be a better solution:

1S-2C;
2D = 5440, 5-5 majors or 4+ clubs
..2H = R
....2S = 5440 or 5-5 majors
......2N = R
........3C = 5440 (then 3D asks)
........3D+ = 5-5 majors

"In the symmetric relay system notes I've found, 2C over a 1M opening is a GF relay."
Then the symmetric notes you have found are not original. In the original system 1M 1NT is a GF relay!

[Free]

I play the system from Garrozzo, but these aren't full relay (although it's close, or you can make them full relays if you want):
2♦ = min without 4OM (rest resolves like 2♠+)
2♥ = 4+OM, any strength
2♠ = 4+♦ (rest resolves like 3♣+)
2NT = no side suit
3♣ = 5M-4♣
3♦ = 6M-4♣
3M = 5M-5♣, shortness (singleton or void)
3NT = 5M, 4♦, 4♣

After 1M-2♣-2♥:
2♠ = relay (usually no fit OM)
...2NT = 5-5 or 5440
......3♣ relay
.........3♦ = min, 5440 (resolves like 3♠/NT)
.........3♥ = 5-5, any strenght (strength isn't resolved)
.........3♠/NT = max, 5440, shortness defined
...3♣ = 5-4, min (resolves like 3♥+)
...3♦ = 6-4, any strength
...3♥/♠ = 5-4, singleton defined
...3NT = 5-4-2-2
2NT = relay with fit OM (-> doesn't have as much accuracy about shortness when 6-4 or 5-5, but sets trumps quite low)

[Kungsgeten]

I quite like this one Free. Are the full system notes available online?

[Zelandakh]

My relays work out as (effectively):

2♦ = 4+ hearts (including 5404/5440)
2♥ = 4+ clubs (including 5044)
2♠ = 1-suited
2NT = 5+ diamonds
3♣ = 5 spades, 4 diamonds
3♦ = 6043/6142
3♥ = 6241
3♠= 6340
3NT = 7+ spades, 4 diamonds

...although I start with a 1NT response (after a 1♠ opening) as an INV+ relay so the calls other than 2♦ also have some additional strength information included.

[Free]

Kungsgeten, on 2013-August-20, 08:25, said:

I quite like this one Free. Are the full system notes available online?

Here's a link: Ambra

[mr1303]

I play after 1M 2C
2D = 6+M
2H = 3OM
2S = 2OM
2NT = 4OM
3C = 1OM
3D = 5OM

[olien]

The structure I play is based on what Fredin-Lindkvist play(ed):

1♠ - 2♣:

2♦ = 4+♣, 5(332), or 5(440)
....2♠ = 5(332) or 5(440)
........3♣ = 5(332)
........3♦+ = 5(440)
....2NT+ = 4+♣
2♥ = 4+♦
2♠ = 6+♠
2NT = 5+♠ 5+♥
3♣ = 5+♠ 4♥ 0-1♦
3♦ = 5=4=2=2
3♥ = 5=4=3=1
3♠ = 6=4=2=1
3NT = 6=4=3=0

In general, this has worked well for us.