[kgr]

Scoring: IMP

Pass-(1C)-?

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Partner passed. Do you consider bidding a weak 2♠ with this hand?
If not: what is the minimum change you need to bid 2♠?
thanks,
Koen

[655321]

1♠ for me.
If your partnership has decided to play like this, you could decide to bid 2♠ here, at favorable and with partner being a passed hand, but with a good hand I prefer to make my normal bid.
If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO. Bidding this way is a legitimate style, just not the one I prefer.

[kgr]

655321, on Feb 29 2008, 12:15 AM, said:

If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO.

Partner is pickup on BBO. No agreements.
The idea is to bid 2♠ with 5 or 6 spades and 0 to 12 (13?) pts...Any hand you don't see a lot chanche to make game with a passed partner. Only make it more difficult for opps.
...but maybe this hand is too good?

[mike777]

1s

1) We have lots of chances for game.
2) I want partner to know I may have defense if we defend not pure off. hand.

[helene_t]

Let's give p some random 10-count:
KQx-xxxx-KQx-xxx makes 4♠ with ♣A on-side
Qx-Axxx-Qxxx-Qxx probably makes 2♠

I think the chance of missing a game is quite low. I would bid 2♠ at favorable. No idea if it's right but preempting is fun.

[pclayton]

1♠. Missing game isn't the issue here. Preempting with a lousy suit and outside defense is.

Do you pard to sac over 4♥ with 4 spades and an outside card? I sure don't.

[han]

1S, really dislike 2S.

[kenrexford]

I firmly believe that the faster you get to 2♠ in this sequence, the better.

The corollary is that 1♠ shows more serious game interest.

That said, the diamond 10 has me troubled. I initially clicked 2♠, but I wish to change my vote, like a superdelegate, to 1♠, but only because of the diamond 10.

[gwnn]

2♠ is horrible with this hand.

closest to this one is I think

KQT853
J8
AT4
65
.

ATxxxx is bad for a preempt. It's just not good. Just bad. Try to avoid it.

[whereagles]

2♠. Opposite a passed pard, you can (perhaps should) randomize your jump overcalls a bit. Make sure u tell pard to bid only with a fit

[gwnn]

One of the biggest problems I've seen low ODR WJO's cause is the preempt getting passed out and you getting to a lousy contract. You have about 19 hcp, you would have belonged to another contract, they can make nothing.

[jdonn]

I have stated before that I simply don't understand this trend in some circles to preempt after partner passed on hands that are

- very good
and (even moreso)
- not preemptive in nature!

You are probably just racking up small losses when they let you play there or partner misjudges without any compensating large gains.

[skjaeran]

This hand is just a little too good offensively to overcall 2♠. We might still have game. But this is a minor flaw compared with:

The hand is far too good defensively. With 2.5 (or even more) defensive tricks, making a wjo will far too often induce partner to make the wrong decision over 4♥, making a phantom save.

So this is a clear 1♠ to me.

[Cascade]

1♠ game is too likely as is a penalty if i bid 2♠

[P_Marlowe]

2S, but 1S is normal, but even 3S may work
out sometimes, although the suit quality is to
bad.

The best you can is to vary your bids, open 1S
most of the time, but 2S sometimes.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

kgr, on Feb 28 2008, 05:20 PM, said:

655321, on Feb 29 2008, 12:15 AM, said:

If you do routinely bid 2♠ here with good hands whenever partner has passed, then you are not really playing weak jumps, IMO.

Partner is pickup on BBO. No agreements.
The idea is to bid 2♠ with 5 or 6 spades and 0 to 12 (13?) pts...Any hand you don't see a lot chanche to make game with a passed partner. Only make it more difficult for opps.
...but maybe this hand is too good?

If you are playing with a pickup, than 1S
is clear cut.

1) you keep tensions low, if you are taking normal
actions
2) you know beforehand, how a given auction my
likely develop
The intention to bid 2S is to play games with the
opponents, this means, your partner should
stay out, if you have no idea, if this particular
player will stay out of your way, dont test him

With kind regards
Marlowe

[joker_gib]

1♠ obvious for me with this defense

[kgr]

Thanks all for the answers.
(Very interersting comments I found that this hand has too much defence for 2S)
This is the full story:

Scoring: IMP

P-(1C)-2S-All Pass

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Making 2♠+2.
LHO was table host and he removed me after this hand, telling me that 2♠ was a Novice bid.

[kenrexford]

A bit of a harsh reaction, considering that most experts make bids at times that even they in retrospect would admit to be "novice" bids.

[P_Marlowe]

kgr, on Feb 29 2008, 08:00 PM, said:

<snip>
LHO was table host and he removed me after this hand, telling me that 2♠ was a Novice bid.

Be grateful, it would not have been fun anyway
playing at this table.

With kind regards
Marlowe