[cherdano]

(If you have seen this, maybe keep quiet...)

IMPS all red.
♠T97 ♥KQ9xxx ♦- ♣98xx
LHO opens 1S, RHO 1N, LHO 2H, partner comes in with 3D which RHO doubles.

Anything to do?

(vulnerability added)

This post has been edited by cherdano: 2007-October-02, 11:22

[matmat]

i've never seen a ♣0 card

[cherdano]

matmat, on Oct 2 2007, 11:01 AM, said:

i've never seen a ♣0 card

Me neither, why are you posting this here?

[matmat]

anyway. i assume that's the 10.

i am guessing p has a penalty pass of spades with a goooood hand and now, staring at a heart void is afraid that it will pass out in hearts in the opps "inferred" ♥ fit.

i am not sure what i'd do.
3♥, 3♠, and pass all come to mind here

i think i 3♥ and hope p does something intelligent

[Fluffy]

pass, at MP I might try soemthing else

[ArtK78]

I pass. Partner knows what he is doing (I hope).

[mikeh]

I also hope partner knows what he is doing, because I am bidding 3♠ (2nd choice 3♥). He should be showing spades and diamonds. I consider 3♥ because I can probably do ok in this suit while a trump lead against 3♠ may be problematic... if I could get partner to declare spades, then I'd be a lot happier since rho may be void (partner will often be 5=5 in the pointeds, maybe 5=6 with poorish diamonds.

The one thing I would take to the bank with a competent partner is that he has spades.

If he is a novice or an idiot, then all bets are off Then I'd bid 3♥ for sure.

[kenrexford]

I'll assume partner knows what he is doing.

I'll also assume partner knows that I know what I am doing.

Those two assumptions convince me to bid 3♥. 3♦ after an initial pass suggests a back-up plan. That back-up plan could be heart tolerance or spades, or both.

3♥ by me also cannot logically be unilateral, IMO. I believe that 3♥ equally suggests a backup plan, an option. So, partner will/should convert 3♥ to 3♠ with a heart void and five spades.

[han]

3♠.

3♥ second choice, partner could be 5-2-5-1 in which case 3H probably plays better. And if you bid 3H then you can still run if they find a double.

[skjaeran]

Add me in for 3♠. I'm confident partner knows what he's doing, and also that he expects me to know what he's doing.

[whereagles]

I'm not so sure pard knows what he's doing, so I'm gonna bid what I have: 3♥.

[pclayton]

This is a very interesting problem and I think there are two likely possibilities:

1. Pard has some sort of spade trap but he decided to get involved. I have a problem with this definition, because there is a quantum difference between passing over a minor and then getting involved, and doing the same over a major.

This is a common auction: (1♦) - pass - (1 grape) - pass - (1N) - 2♣

I would fully expect the overcaller to have four or five clubs but 5 or more great diamonds.

Can we do this after a major? I've never seen it, but maybe its possible. After all, how would you want to bid something like: ♠AQJxx ♥x ♦KJxxx ♣x? Is there a hand where pard would pass over 1♠, but wade out the 3 level in a no-fit auction? We are also looking at ♠T9x so there's just room enough for 5 spades in pard's hand. I'm very skeptical about this possibility only because its hard to construct a hand where pard would take an action like this.

2. Pard is 'pre-balancing' over 2♥. If pard's initial 2-level overcalls are sound (like mine), this is a plausible explanation of whats going on. How would you bid something like: ♠AQxx ♥x ♦Kxxxxx ♣Kx? I wouldn't mind a pass with this initially with a moth-eaten diamond suit.

Note that "1" and "2" are relative cousins. The only real difference is moving a spade to the diamond suit.

It probably doesn't matter what we do because I think we are in 4-digit territory with Mr. Adventurous across the table. Nevertheless, I think there's a reasonable chance that we'll catch 4, possible 5 spades across from us, and that's our best chance to escape.

So 3♠ for me too.

[Fluffy]

Nice analysis Phil, but you forgot a third option, that partner was walking the dog with loads of diamonds.

I am happy that neither of the 3 fit my partner's way of thinking

[han]

pclayton, on Oct 2 2007, 04:29 PM, said:

1) ♠AQJxx ♥x ♦KJxxx ♣x?

2) ♠AQxx ♥x ♦Kxxxxx ♣Kx?

Note that "1" and "2" are relative cousins. The only real difference is moving a spade to the diamond suit.

Also a club card appeared out of nowhere Phil.


I'd fire my partner if he tried the pre-balance joke.

[Impact]

Partner MUST have S if he is sane (unless as Fluffy put it he is walking the dog), but if I bid H partner might take that as a cue for D as much as S (last bid suit as we hypothesise that he is looking at short H.

It is all very well to say that H must be natural but wouldn't you bid this way with useful D cards and some C ie hoping to reach 5D?? I think you are mightily fixed with H and have to assume that he has both long D and long S .....but short H and a very good hand.

Accordingly my choice seems to be between 3S (simple preference) and 4S. Is 5-0-5-3 the likely hand or even 5 very goodS -0-6moderateD-2C??? Surely if he only held 4S but a long good suit elsewhere he bids it on the previous round???
regards

[mikeh]

Impact, on Oct 3 2007, 01:53 AM, said:

Partner MUST have S if he is sane (unless as Fluffy put it he is walking the dog), but if I bid H partner might take that as a cue for D as much as S (last bid suit as we hypothesise that he is looking at short H.

It is all very well to say that H must be natural but wouldn't you bid this way with useful D cards and some C ie hoping to reach 5D?? I think you are mightily fixed with H and have to assume that he has both long D and long S .....but short H and a very good hand.

Accordingly my choice seems to be between 3S (simple preference) and 4S. Is 5-0-5-3 the likely hand or even 5 very goodS -0-6moderateD-2C??? Surely if he only held 4S but a long good suit elsewhere he bids it on the previous round???
regards

If 5♦ has play. I'll take my chances in 3♦ doubled. thanks

[Impact]

Mike,
my comment was obviously to counteract the recurring line : "I bid what I've got" ie H but on this auction CHO must take a H bid as a move with D support (and that is a hand which I might bid H) but it would be foolish to succumb to Alice THrough the Looking Glass temptation as the meaning of a bid is not determined by the hand you hold.

Recognising the smilie, you don't really want to sit in 3D do you ??
regards

[cherdano]

The scores for our side were between -1100 and +1100, including a +990 in 4♠X+1.

http://www.swangames.com/rama/boardreview....gno=6&boardno=4

Since even those who are to lazy to click on the link shouldn't miss the beauty of East's minor suits, here is the full hand:

---

Both major games make, and both 3H and 3S should get us there (or to defending 5♣X). Passing doesn't work so well, as a player from SA had to find out on this exact auction.

[Fluffy]

NEvermind, I can blame partner for failing to bid 2♦ first round